What the hell happened.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Lately I've been considering it may actually be time to pull the plug in and end the simulation as we know it, perhaps replaced with something different.

A moot point perhaps in the sense that if even a small group of people want to carry on, they very much can and will; but I wonder - sincerely - how much enjoyment the remaining active players are getting out of it, or whether Atlasia is actually running on autopilot.

Twenty years (!) of history is absolutely, utterly impressive by any meaningful standards anyway, so whatever happens to Atlasia, it has certainly done all of us - past and present players - proud.

Yeah Atlasia will never literally die unless it becomes so unstaffable you can't even try to downsize it procedurally, or if the mods just decide to lock up the boards. However the game died for all intents and purposes a while back, with Laki's reign representing an effective last hurrah. I would like to revive this game's structure but it's not helpful when people often vote No on the simplest reforms because of unrelated issues or a desire for "local control" above all else. I've been here long enough, I may as well try to contribute until the end, but I don't see a real path forward.

I actually think the solution may indeed be to lock up the Atlasia boards with the intention of creating a new simulation after a much needed break.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

"Laki's reign"… of what, terror? Or is there some new revisionism going on that he's been shadow president since February 2023?

I'd like Wulfric's input on when exactly "a while back" was.

Laki controlled or played a major part in basically every outcome the left achieved from February of 2023 to February of 2024. From you not getting a third term as President, to Peace's dominance over other leftist parties in the Senate, to Tim's election as President, to the fact that Peace still controls the PPTship today, Laki's fingerprints were everywhere. He also spent pretty much every hour of the election pming, discord dming, and on at least one occasion, even actually making a phone call to get people to vote.

The Game died sometime around the Kansas Crisis. Laki revived it, but it was never going to be forever. This was the first cycle since October 2022 where Laki played literally no role, and now we see the true state of the game.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

"Laki's reign"… of what, terror? Or is there some new revisionism going on that he's been shadow president since February 2023?

I'd like Wulfric's input on when exactly "a while back" was.

Laki controlled or played a major part in basically every outcome the left achieved from February of 2023 to February of 2024. From you not getting a third term as President, to Peace's dominance over other leftist parties in the Senate, to Tim's election as President, to the fact that Peace still controls the PPTship today, Laki's fingerprints were everywhere. He also spent pretty much every hour of the election pming, discord dming, and on at least one occasion, even actually making a phone call to get people to vote.

The Game died sometime around the Kansas Crisis. Laki revived it, but it was never going to be forever. This was the first cycle since October 2022 where Laki played literally no role, and now we see the true state of the game.

I like how in order for the narrative to stand this post has to skip over pretty much my entire presidency, lol. Did all of us stand around after Kansas waiting for Laki to come back and revive it? Was YT taking instructions from Laki to push the idea of buying Greenland? Convenient memory holing going on there.

Correction to your post. A group of malcontents decided to try killing the game for the first time during Kansas, tried to justify it because the game was going to die anyway, failed, and quit. In particular to this day they insist that the game ended when they left. So excuse me for not liking that you're picking up their narrative wholesale.

Anyway, hilariously insane to insinuate that Spiral is PPT because of Laki's influence and not, you know, being president. Or that spamming people worse than any other player in living memory was what kept the game alive.

While the preferred outcome of the Kansas Crisis plotters did not occur, what it did succeed in doing was shattering the very nature of the game. This game is at its core, a non-partisan elections simulator, and when that was called into question, many people, particularly in the left where the norms had been violated, no longer had a lasting interest, resulting in the dominance of the Right throughout much of 2022. Laki campaigned to such a degree that many of these leftists came back and voted simply to shut him up, but they were never seriously going to participate once Laki left the scene.

Peace's endorsement of Tack singlehandedly decided the February 2023 election. Spiral never becomes President without Laki's influence. Same goes for Tim. Laki didn't necessarily keep the game itself alive, but he certainly did keep the left alive. You may not like how he campaigned, but it was what the left needed. Without it, you would have been re-elected to a 3rd term as President and it's hard to see any leftist faction gaining power at any meaningful point to this day.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

So… did I win? what happens in a tie?

ReallySuper received 4 votes to 2 each for you and Spark. Both your votes and Spark's exhaust immediately, so ReallySuper is the winner.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

So… did I win? what happens in a tie?

ReallySuper received 4 votes to 2 each for you and Spark. Both your votes and Spark's exhaust immediately, so ReallySuper is the winner.

Laki deregistered two weeks ago and MB voted twice as far as I can tell

Wasn't counting Laki. Ok on MB, but we no longer have the rule that voting twice invalidates you. We simply count only the first vote. So that leaves MB, ReallySuper, and Retro electing ReallySuper.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I did not make a phone call to turn out people. That wasn't me.

With regards to the state of the game, i don't even think the game is to blame. If you notice the number of people that registered for the forum in 2016 compared to now, you'll notice a big issue and you have to consider that a lot of the game always relied on was newly registered people getting active. Eventually forums like these are a bit old-fashioned and new young people probably talk rather on discord or other social media about politics than internet forums which is a more of a 00's-10's things. Most people active here are ones that have been active for at least half a decade, some way more than that.

Few people back in 2016 were still participating in 2022. And a big reason for the 2020-2021 revival was lockdown and the pandemic. And YT having a wide connection circle on Discord for his elections.

This game is intensive, everyone needs a break or is at some point less active, barring perhaps a few exceptions. And burning out is easy. I'm no exception to that. Though in my case - there are other reasons as well that played a factor.

February 2023 also wasn't personal, like if you ran for your first term i probably wouldn't have opposed you but a lot of the game is about elections (probably the most fun part of the game), and I provided a competitive election. Labor - especially Pericles - also helped Tack at the time too, but without Peace it wouldn't have been enough.

A lot about the motivation was self-redeeming myself - because virtually anyone else didn't take me serious - and having a project or a goal in making Peace the most dominant party in Atlasia for a while and electing the first Peace president via an election which Spiral eventually did twice. Him and Tim are both what I consider atlasia institutions, you are as well ofc (you are a two term president too).

I didn't mention the phone call actually! But everything you've said here is closer to the mark than Wulfric and his intensely hyperbolic arguments, in terms of being a brick in the left wall rather than the only reason they succeeded.

It may be interesting to fantasize how the left may have succeeded if Laki was not present, but in the universe we live in, Laki, like in a game of JENGA, was the brick that would have proved fatal to remove throughout most of 2023, and that even into 2024 and Tim's bid for Presidency was highly influential. You can't look at to the extent to which Laki campaigned, and the big turnout drop in the first cycle in which they did not care, and presume Laki's absence did not play a role.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I did not make a phone call to turn out people. That wasn't me.

With regards to the state of the game, i don't even think the game is to blame. If you notice the number of people that registered for the forum in 2016 compared to now, you'll notice a big issue and you have to consider that a lot of the game always relied on was newly registered people getting active. Eventually forums like these are a bit old-fashioned and new young people probably talk rather on discord or other social media about politics than internet forums which is a more of a 00's-10's things. Most people active here are ones that have been active for at least half a decade, some way more than that.

Few people back in 2016 were still participating in 2022. And a big reason for the 2020-2021 revival was lockdown and the pandemic. And YT having a wide connection circle on Discord for his elections.

This game is intensive, everyone needs a break or is at some point less active, barring perhaps a few exceptions. And burning out is easy. I'm no exception to that. Though in my case - there are other reasons as well that played a factor.

February 2023 also wasn't personal, like if you ran for your first term i probably wouldn't have opposed you but a lot of the game is about elections (probably the most fun part of the game), and I provided a competitive election. Labor - especially Pericles - also helped Tack at the time too, but without Peace it wouldn't have been enough.

A lot about the motivation was self-redeeming myself - because virtually anyone else didn't take me serious - and having a project or a goal in making Peace the most dominant party in Atlasia for a while and electing the first Peace president via an election which Spiral eventually did twice. Him and Tim are both what I consider atlasia institutions, you are as well ofc (you are a two term president too).

I didn't mention the phone call actually! But everything you've said here is closer to the mark than Wulfric and his intensely hyperbolic arguments, in terms of being a brick in the left wall rather than the only reason they succeeded.

It may be interesting to fantasize how the left may have succeeded if Laki was not present, but in the universe we live in, Laki, like in a game of JENGA, was the brick that would have proved fatal to remove throughout most of 2023, and that even into 2024 and Tim's bid for Presidency was highly influential. You can't look at to the extent to which Laki campaigned, and the big turnout drop in the first cycle in which they did not care, and presume Laki's absence did not play a role.

I do not see the leap from Laki being a key reason for the left's success to your initial posts of "Laki's gone, the game is dead."

A 75 vote election is evidence of death all by itself. The game can be revived under another Laki-like figure, but it's dead rn.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I have not paid attention in a looong time and did not even vote (I forgot) but if there is a commited group of players I don't think the game needs to be shut down

I do not know about the bare minimum amount of players, but I'd say it is probably around 10 or so active players to staff all mandatory roles?

Assuming no Constitutional Amendment:

Game Moderator (3)
President
Vice President
Attorney General-Secretary of Internal Affairs (combined role)
Secretary of State
SoFE/RG (combined role)
Supreme Court (5)
Senators (18)
Lincoln Governor
LGC (3)
Fremont FM
Fremont Parliament (3)
Southern Prince
Southern Vice Prince

41. You could of course have some dual officeholders, shrink the Senate and/or SCOA and/or abolish the regions but this is the current base structure.